Hey folks, Mark Scroggins with Scroggins Law Group, we are back for another edition of the Reclamation Transformation. And we have Cindy Hyde with us once again. How are you today?
Cindy Hyde 0:15
I’m good Mark, how are you?
Mark Scroggins 0:17
I am good. Well, hey, I enjoyed our previous conversations about, you know, the control wheels. And so I wanted to continue on that today and specifically get into some of the post separation economic power and control. And talk about how that is how that is used by the bad actor also, right?
Cindy Hyde 0:42
Yeah. Yeah, by the unsafe parent, or There you go. Right. And because we have a safe parent, and we have an unsafe parent, typically in this dynamic, right, and what the unsafe parent experiences, you know, ruined credit. They experienced things like, you know, inhibited employment or a loss of education, because they might have to quit school to try to pay, you know, their financial debt that gets incurred when there’s been economic abuse, you know, situations. And so some of them may even have to declare bankruptcy or, you know, rely on their parents to help them pay court fees. Right. And so it can get really difficult for a safe parent in trying to provide for their children.
Mark Scroggins 1:26
Yeah, absolutely. No question. And there’s, there’s legislation that they’ve got in the UK, and you see it now in Canada. I think Hawaii, instituted some and it’s not, you know, hasn’t been adopted throughout the rest of the, throughout the rest of the US. And so that’s really important to say is that a lot of the stuff we’re talking about, it’s really up to your attorney to be able to educate the court as to what is going on, and to show that it’s actually what you are claiming it to be, and not what it appears to be. Because sometimes, it is exactly what it looks like.
Cindy Hyde 2:09
Exactly. And that and that’s where to, and we’ve talked about this before. And what I tell my clients is you have to document everything, right. And so if you feel like you’re in a situation where there’s economic abuse, then you need to make sure that your attorney knows, you know, as quickly as possible, so that then, you know, he or she can talk to the judge to let them know that, hey, we’ve been in here 10 times already. And this is really a financial drain on my client.
Mark Scroggins 2:35
Yeah. And it’s something that it has to be part of what your strategy is, is to inform the court to educate the court on exactly what’s going on, you know, if you have been taken back to court over and over and over again, and there’s not a good reason for it, okay, you need to educate the court as to how you are being pulled back on just a bunch of BS type situations, and educating the court on that is really, really important. Okay, now, it needs to actually be what you are claiming it to be, or else you can fully expect the wrath of the court to come down and, and slap you around a little bit. That to that claim. So let’s let’s get into this. Once again, there’s another wheel folks, this is the post separation economic power and control wheel. And let’s talk about these different things and how they are utilized by the bad actor. Right. Okay. So the first the first cog in the wheel, and there are eight different cogs here is using harassment and intimidation. Correct?
Cindy Hyde 3:48
Yeah. And so what will happen sometimes is they’ll, if they can’t get through to you with harassment and intimidation, they’ll go after your family and friends and start scaring them. So that then the person, you know, that safe parent then feels like they have to respond, because they’re, you know, the safe parents to target them. Right.
Mark Scroggins 4:10
Can you give an example of the of the harassment, I mean, that you’ve seen in your practice, or anything that you’re aware of, because I’m, you know, some of this stuff, frankly, you know, it sounds outlandish, and it is Outland. Yeah. So the average person, I think, can be taken off guard when, when this kind of stuff appears. So can you give an example? Yeah.
Cindy Hyde 4:34
And so not long ago, I heard about a case that the, the, they wanted financial money from the safe parent, even though they made a lot more money. They were saying that the safe parent was coming after them for all their money when in fact, the safe parent was actually choosing not to take anything from the legal proceedings. They didn’t they just wanted out of the relationship. They didn’t want anything. Well, what ended up happening Nadine, is because she stopped responding to all of his threats and allegations and, and everything like that. Then he went after her parents and her family saying, you know, she’s trying to take everything I have. And if she gets one penny from me, I’m coming after you. And so then her family scared, and they don’t know what to do. And but the truth was, was that she really was she wasn’t asking for anything. And he was the one holding up the divorce proceedings, again, because she’s the target. And so he wanted her to feel unsafe. And so that’s why he he went after her family like that,
Mark Scroggins 5:35
well, so I hope that the families out there that are on the receiving end of this kind of thing would know that that is nothing more than a threat, there’s nothing that they can do to come after you for money that they lose, right? To the other party in a divorce proceeding. So that’s about asinine. It’s an empty threat,
Cindy Hyde 5:54
right? Well, and what happens to if the if the safe parent, you know, hasn’t told the family and friends, like, I’m not going after anything, then they don’t know who to believe. So they’re so then they’re thinking, Well, is he telling the truth is he is it true that, that she’s going after everything, and now he’s gonna come after us, and they get scared. And so then it causes, you know, family upset, which is actually what the unsafe parent wants is to create chaos and drama and erratic situations.
Mark Scroggins 6:27
That’s just crazy to me. So the next is using emotional abuse.
Cindy Hyde 6:33
Yeah, and so, so one of the things they they do, and I’ve seen this happen in some of my cases, where, you know, if the safe parent, like makes a purchase for a child, say it’s, maybe they need a new phone, and so they get them a new phone, then the unsafe parent will start screaming that they’re spoiling the child or they’re, they’re harming the child by, you know, letting them have a phone that they could be looking at all kinds of unsafe, you know, internet sites. And so they’ll, you know, I’ve seen them even, you know, put that in documentation to take them back to court to say they’re putting the child in harm’s way because they bought them a phone. And so, you know, they’ll do things like that. It’s crazy. I mean, it sounds crazy, and it is crazy. But they will do things like
Mark Scroggins 7:19
that. Right. Yeah. So here’s what I wanted to spend some time on a little bit. So using or abusing court processes.
Cindy Hyde 7:28
Yeah. And so I had a client a few years ago, that she, I think, I think at last count, she had gone to court about 15 times, oh, man, they had they had three children together. And and she every time she turned around, you know, she was getting taken back to court for something. Usually it was, you know, not enough visitation or, or, you know, that she, you know, what he would do is he would ask her to see the kids on an off day or weekend and when not a period of his possession, right? What’s your turn, when she would refuse, he would scream parental alienation. And so then he’d take her back to court for alienating the children when she was just simply saying no, because they had football practice, or they had some, something they had to be at, not because she was trying to be difficult, she just, you know, they had other obligations. And if she said no, he would find, he would find a way to call that parental alienation and take her back to court.
Mark Scroggins 8:27
So once again, it is incredibly, incredibly important to document all these things correct. And then additionally, it is even more important to hire the right lawyer, and you need to talk to the lawyer up front about all of this stuff that is going on and what you think, is actually happening. Because if you don’t write, then the lawyer doesn’t know what he or she is facing. So when you go through the interview process of, you know, what lawyer should I should I hire one start with someone who’s board certified. So they’ve got a much more heightened level of expertise in these in these things, but then you need to educate them on hear the things that are going on. Right. And so that they know that as part of the strategy that is going on that they can start educating the court.
Cindy Hyde 9:23
Yeah, and that’s true too. And and also even, you know, finding out if your attorney understands pathology. Sure, you know, that and what I mean by that is Cluster B personality disorders, you know, so, you know, as we talk to so when
Mark Scroggins 9:37
you say Cluster B, can you educate the folks out there as to what we’re talking about?
Cindy Hyde 9:41
Yep. So you remember last time I told you the word narcissism is is grossly overused out there. Absolutely. And you know, really truly narcissism is just grandiosity and attention seeking, right. It is not all of the the litany of bad behaviors that a lot of people call Well, narcissism. It’s actually a lot of times when there’s deceit and manipulation and egocentricity. And you know, the pathological line that’s actually psychopathy or psychopath, right. And then you know, the doing things within the letter of the law or, you know, doing criminal behavior is actually sociopath. It’s not narcissism, right? And so, so many people out there, you know, talk about narcissism. So they go in and tell their attorney, I’ve been married to a narcissist and the attorneys like, Yeah, whatever. Because, you know, everybody comes in here and says, I was married to a narcissist, no, you need to educate your attorney on exactly all of the things that you were dealing with. So your attorney at least knows how to fight for you. Right? And because oftentimes, you know, that doesn’t happen, they just come in, you know, to you, I’m sure I’m sure you’ve heard it a million times. You know, they come in and say, I’m pretty sure I was married to a narcissist. Well, actually, you know, some of that, you know, high rage, you know, tendencies and high emotionality is actually borderline personality disorder. It’s not narcissism, right. And so, you know, for the attorneys to even be educated on what pathology is, which are those are, which are personality disorders, multiple, so antisocial, which is sociopath, psychopathy, which is psychopath, narcissism and borderline personality disorder. And that, that makes up what’s called Cluster B. So it’s a cluster of personality disorders, it’s rarely just one. And that’s what you know, a lot of people think I’ve just dealt with one thing, no, you’ve probably dealt with two, three, or four. And not just one. So once the attorney can kind of identify that, and I gave you that pictometry checklist, so that even you know, you could do that with your client, if you chose to, to just see, like, I want to know what you experience. So therefore, then you’re a little more educated about what you’re going to go up against the court system, because they’re going to use everything on that checklist, you know, as part of the way they fight in court, too. And so what happens a lot of times is they will, you know, just like they fought in the relationship, which was unfair, and erratic and dramatic, right and chaotic, they’ll do the same thing in the court system. So they’ll, you know, everything will be, you know, blame shifting to the one partner, it’ll all be, you know, that, that they’re alienating the, you know, the child from them, when in actuality it’s them creating all of the chaos.
Speaker 3 12:30
Wow, that is, you know, that’s
Mark Scroggins 12:33
as, as an attorney, that’s a difficult thing to deal with. So it’s super, super important to be educated absolutely about that. Because if you’re not, you really don’t know how to educate the court. And that process of educating the court needs to start from the very first time that you are in front of the judge. Absolutely. You know, so there, there are certain behaviors, and unfortunately, our judiciary, I don’t think is trained in all this to the extent that they need to, and frankly, the US in my this my humble opinion, at least Texas, let’s say Texas, right, for sure, is not ready to get get into any kind of, you know, economic, economic coercion, and power and control and things like that, like that we’re talking today. But you can educate an individual court and individual judge about the so they have a different they’re looking through things with a different lens,
Cindy Hyde 13:32
right? Because if you have, let’s say the unsafe parent makes 10 times what the safe parent makes, right. And the unsafe parent is the one filing all of these allegations all the time, you know, somebody needs to look at that, you know, like you said, maybe it’s true that this parent is the unsafe one, and this parent is not, but somebody needs to look at who is who is filing all these different allegations all the time, and who’s getting bled financially, completely dry, you know, I’ve seen cases where, you know, women at the end of the day, and and I say women and it could be a man too. Sure, right. But but we’re the safe parent feels like they have to give up custody of their child to the unsafe parent, because they’re running out of money. And so many of them will go pro se or represent themselves, so that they, you know, they, you know, can can keep living and eating right, you know, that they get so financially drained. They don’t, you know, sometimes even know where their next meal is gonna come from, and therefore they’ll give up custody to the unsafe parent as much as it pains them to do that.
Mark Scroggins 14:39
Yeah. Yeah. And that is something that I’ve seen that people have to make that that hard decision, you know, I’ve also seen people make that decision that they don’t want to tap into certain funds that they have, you know, to do that. So it’s a it’s a question of what is really important to you in that regard. So here’s one That is that is very related to what we were talking about here in manipulating institutions. Can you talk a little bit about that?
Cindy Hyde 15:08
Yeah. And so, you know, they may, you know, tell the court that they’re now unemployed, when they when they were self employed, that their business is doing doing so bad that they had to closed it and what they’ll do, as soon as the court proceedings are over, they’ll just open a new business. I’ve even heard about them adjusting their deputy wages if they’re self employed to a much lower amount so that they don’t have to pay the proper child support. So in essence, they’re they’re manipulating the court system.
Mark Scroggins 15:38
Yeah. Now, let me mention a couple of things. So the court has in its bag of tricks, so the courts in Texas can look back for a period of three years. So just because someone changed something, right. You also have, you know, someone being intentionally unemployed, or intentionally underemployed. Okay, so you’ve got a way to combat those things. So someone who says that, oh, I can’t get a job, I haven’t been able to find a job. You know, some people aren’t just aren’t willing to take certain kinds of jobs. Right. That’s one problem. And you have other people that make something look on its face, like, what it is not? What it is not? Exactly. And so. So the court also, like I said, court can look back three years to see, you know, what has been the average of what they have been making. And so the court will do that a lot of the time. And so these are important things to talk about, you know, if you think that, you know, look, he’s just doing this to manipulate the situation, I know, he’s doing stuff on the side, the problem is, you’ve got to be able to prove that he is doing something exact on the side. So sometimes it is just suspicion, you know, but, but that’s where you start looking into what the other party’s actions are. So if they’re saying that I’m broke, I don’t have any money, I can’t do this, I can’t do that. But they’re always going on vacation, or they just bought a new car driving that new Mercedes. That’s right. You know, some things don’t necessarily add up. Right. And, you know, I
Cindy Hyde 17:15
think that’s such good information. Mark, I know, my clients need to know that, that, you know, they can go back three years, because oftentimes they feel helpless. Right. And then I think, you know, that’s important also to, for the attorneys to let their clients know that if, if this is happening, that we can look back over three years, and, you know, see if there’s actually, you know, if he’s actually playing games here, I think too, that’s where forensic accountants come in, also, that you can count through and figure out where money’s been going. You know, I know they’re not foolproof, but I do know that they, you know, can be very helpful sometimes in those situations,
Mark Scroggins 17:51
well, especially like when you’re dealing with self employment, because one of the one of the places that you look, you know, retained earnings are earnings, right, which means they’re subject to distribution, and they should be looked at when it comes to the distribution of the marital estate. It also should be looked at when you’re determining what child support should be. So if you’re at one of these things, where you’re trying to determine should it be at max guidelines? Or where should it be? Well, you know, if they haven’t distributed 50,000, or 100,000, in earnings that they’ve got, you know, it manipulates what it makes it look like someone is actually earning. So it’s important to talk about these things so that they can educate the court and explain to the court look, Judge, we need to look back over the last three years here, because this person we believe, is intentionally underemployed or intentionally unemployed at this particular juncture. Right? Yeah. So those are all things that are gonna be really important from an educational perspective, right?
Cindy Hyde 18:47
Yeah. And I think it’s important to you know, and I tell this, I say this to my clients a lot. If you don’t know what your financial income in the household is, you need to find out absolutely, because you know, you’re in that marriage, and you have just as much right to understand the finances as your spouse does. Now, they may try to withhold that from you. And oftentimes, in these types of situations, they actually do they keep, they try to keep the spouse, you know, out of knowing any of the financial things. So if it comes to divorce, they can play some games, but, you know, educate yourself on what’s coming in and out of the house financially. It’s important to know and it’s important to have records of those documents for if you do need to see an attorney, you know, you can take the documents and show what you you feel like it’s probably accurate. Yeah, absolutely.
Mark Scroggins 19:38
So moving over from the manipulating institution. So here’s one, it talks about banking. So can you talk a little bit about that?
Cindy Hyde 19:49
Well, and that’s the concealing financial resources. So they may change banks and not tell the spouse about it. They may, you know, remove money from you know that Children’s savings accounts or college funds, I’ve seen that happen. Yeah, you know, where the college funds get drained. And then you know, here, it’s two years out, and the child’s not going to have college funds. Right. So, you know, that happens a lot, too. And speaking of manipulating institutions, one of the ways that institutions get manipulated is the child support. You know, there’s been cases where they don’t pay child support until it’s just about time they’re going to jail or going to court, and they’ll pay it and then they’re off the hook. But yet, the safe parent has been struggling all these months without child support, and sometimes working two or three jobs. And so they’ll manipulate the child support agencies as well, by you know, because a lot of times a lot of a lot of people have figured out like, well, I can, I can play this little game for three to six months, and not have to pay before anything happens to me, because really, in these situations, when you’re dealing with pathology, the target is the unsafe is the safe parent. Right? Right. So they don’t really care, especially if they’ve got antisocial, they don’t care if the child support people are coming after them. Right, you know, so they don’t the target is the unsafe parent, they want to make the unsafe parent is uncomfortable, and financially strained as possible, because then too, they can blame the financial situation on the unsafe parent to the children. So there’s like all of these, you know, spinning wheels that happen all the time, in situations like this, where, you know, the unsafe parent will then get blamed because they don’t have any money. Yeah, well, it’s not my problem, that your mother doesn’t buy you things, or it’s not my problem, that you don’t have enough food, you know, your mother, if she, you know, would spend the child support appropriately, you know, then then you would have food. And in fact, they’ve been withholding the child support all this time. So, you know, it’s really a tough dynamic for a safe parent to be in when when these types of games are being played?
Mark Scroggins 21:55
Well, that’s one of the things we were talking about B, before the podcast about, you know, with child support, child support is not technically late in the state of Texas, until it’s over 30 days track, you know, so if it’s due on the first, and you’re getting paid on the 29th, and it isn’t February, okay, then it’s still, it’s still timely, you know, so there are ways to manipulate that situation. Yeah. Just to Jack with the other person. And you see that, you see that. And that’s something that courts need to take into consideration that if there’s no rhyme or reason to why a person is doing this, you know, it’s not that they’re in financial hardship. It’s not that, you know, that they’ve had a really bad month or something like that. It’s just that I’m making the same amount. I’m just yeah, they’re just not to pay it. Yeah.
Cindy Hyde 22:48
The safe parent, and the thing is, and, you know, if they have pathology, they don’t care if they’re late. Right, it doesn’t bother them a bit that and that’s why sometimes they’ll wait all the way until it’s like, they’re about to they’re about to go to jail for it, then they’ll pay up. You know, and so, you know, that too, I think is is information to take to your attorney, you know, and, and to make sure the attorney is aware that these games are being played,
Mark Scroggins 23:15
right. Yeah, totally agree. The next thing they talk about is using the children.
Cindy Hyde 23:22
Yeah, so the so you know, especially the younger children, they’ll use the children to blame the parent or shame the parent for their financial situation. And so even though they’re the ones that have been, you know, forcing the drain on the finances, for the safe parent, you know, they’ll they’ll say things like, you know, you know, I’m sorry, Your mother doesn’t ever buy you anything, I’ll take care of that. So they’ll they’ll make it appear where it’s the the safe parent that’s not providing when it’s actually them that are that are affecting that. And they’re keeping the unsafe parent or the safe parent in financial distress all the time. So they can’t do any extras for the children. And that they’ll paint it as they’re choosing not to because they’re not spending their child support appropriately, or whatever the case may be. Yeah,
Mark Scroggins 24:13
so aside from, you know, document, document document, what other advice would you give to someone who’s going through that particular scenario?
Cindy Hyde 24:21
You know, I always tell my clients be the truth teller to your children. And so always tell your child the truth is this. And I will always tell you the truth, and so that way the child starts learning that that the safe parent is the one that they’re going to get the truth from. And so, you know, the truth is, is that I haven’t had child support in the last six months, and I’m just waiting on it to be paid. And so you know, because oftentimes, that story is not told to the child and so they’re over here blaming and shaming the parent and thinking it’s really their idea when it’s, it’s coming from the unsafe parent right and So and so you know, the the safe parent has to be the truth teller, they have to be the one saying the truth, you will always get the truth from me. And this is the truth.
Mark Scroggins 25:10
So here’s one of the problems that goes along with that, because courts really don’t like parents to be talking to the kids about scenarios like that. So there’s I think there is a movement afoot to say that this whole idea that you’re not going to have any conversation with kids about anything is ludicrous. You know,
Cindy Hyde 25:35
well, and if you noticed, I never said your dad hasn’t paid child support. I said, Child Support has not been paid.
Mark Scroggins 25:43
Yeah, but that’s semantics. That’s just semantics. So if you know who’s paying, you know, who’s not right, you know, so it’s the same thing there. But that’s something that I personally believe that the courts need to change that. So every, every single, that’s not true. Most courts, okay, have standing orders in place, and part of the standing orders is not to discuss the litigation. You know, that’s fine when you’re dealing with a five or six year old or eight year old. But once you get past a, you know, I personally think that that really does home, right. And it’s not good for the kids you shouldn’t be talking about, well, mom had an affair or dad had an affair or things like that. I agree. But for the kids to understand, you know, look, we’re going through litigation right now, both your dad and I think that you ought to be with us, you know, these are things that these are my personal opinions. Okay, folks, these are my personal opinions. Right? You know, standing orders will tell you don’t use my personal opinions on stuff like that, because I just, I think they’re, I think they’re wrong. And I think most therapists tend to think that they are wrong, because once you get to that age where kids, you know, kids are inquisitive, and they want to know, not only where am I going to be spending the night, but am I okay, over here. And you know, is what Dad’s telling me true? Or is what mom is telling me? True? And I mean, I think that’s the part that the courts have tried to cut off by just saying, Okay, there’s no, there’s no communication whatsoever. And that’s a way to solve it. It’s also a way to cause more problems with some of these kids, in my opinion, then, getting into a little more detail of this is what you can talk about it, this is what you can, yeah, because
Cindy Hyde 27:43
it does cause alienation. You know, like, you know, if the child thinks that the safe parent is not providing well, because they’re not getting the child support. Right, you know, are there they’re not they’re misusing the child support when the truth is, is there not? Because they haven’t received it? Right. You know, I don’t think that’s unfair to tell a child if they’ve been told that they the other parents been misusing the child support because they’re, you know, that party is guilty of, of trying to shame and blame the safe parent. So, you know, it’s it is semantics, your right to bid, you know, to speak the truth. But I don’t think I agree, I don’t think children need to know about affairs, I don’t think they need to know about the sexual life of the parents, you know, but there are certain things that I think in this case, you know, with finances, I think sometimes they have to be told, I didn’t get child support, I can’t buy that extra thing you’re wanting right, you know, and I don’t think you know, I don’t think that that’s wrong, but you’re right, it sounds like it’s very cookie cutter, you know, as far as in the eyes of the court of how they see that, that you can’t talk about anything.
Mark Scroggins 28:54
Yeah, and I understand, you know, here’s another another part of it, let’s say that one party really is going through, and they’re the ones that are supposed to be paying child support, but they’re really going through some financial hardship, you know, they’ve lost a job. You know, they’re having a hard time finding something else, you know, to sit there and beat the hell out of that parent, because they haven’t received their child support payment, where it’s like, look, I don’t have the ability to make that child screen payment. You know, there’s a fine line. And so it’s where each case needs to be looked at separately. So just having the Standing Orders are great on uncertain things, but on certain other things. We need to put things in place that are more case specific than more case, General.
Cindy Hyde 29:46
Right. And I think I think you’re right, I think if a parent really truly can’t pay child support, right, yeah. And that can be proven right? You know, then then that should be the truth that the top child is told In my opinion, you know, and like my opinion is the same as yours, like, you still need to talk to your attorney first. But I think that, you know, if that parent, even if it’s the unsafe parent really, truly can’t pay, then, you know, when that child comes to the safe parent, the safe parents should just be able to say, you know, right now, there aren’t financial means on either side, to be able to do the things you’re asking. So still telling the truth, but not in any way blaming or shaming that other parent. But it’s unfortunate in cases like this, because the insidiousness of the blame and shame comes through the child to the safe parent. And then, you know, by the court documents, they’re trying to do the right thing and not, you know, be unkind about the unsafe parent. But sometimes they’re backed into a corner where they have no choice but to tell the truth and just say, I’m not getting child support.
Mark Scroggins 30:55
Sure. So another area on the wheel that it talks about here is using economic abuse.
Cindy Hyde 31:04
Yeah. And so and so that can show up in cases, like where there’s a marriage, and one of the partners are requiring the other apart the partner to pay rent. You know, it, I think it depends to, you know, how you set up the marital arrangement, if both people contribute to the household fund, or, you know, how that it needs to be determined very early on. But I’ve seen cases where, you know, there, you have the unsafe parent making 10 times what the safe parent makes, but yet, you know, here, the safe parent is working two or three jobs, and they’re being required to pay rent, right. And so, or they may be required to pay all the household bills and rent, you know, so, but to that’s where, you know, if you come into a relationship boundary less, then your boundaries, what little you have are going to be, you know, steamrolled over. And so really, it’s up to you in the very beginning, you know, to have boundaries with that person, because that can prevent you from even marrying into a pathological love relationship, if you have boundaries in the beginning, because a lot of times, somebody with pathology won’t tolerate boundaries, and they’ll, they’ll end up showing you who they are. And so, you know, do your homework in the beginning, when you’re dating, someone makes sure that you know, whether or not they will honor your boundary system,
Mark Scroggins 32:30
or Yeah, it’s hugely important to have these discussions prior to getting married. So, you know, here’s something that happens all the time. One party owns a house, the other party does not, you’re gonna get married and move into that house. So that you should be having conversations about what are your expectations? As far as you know, are you going to put me on the house? Are you not going to put me on the house? And there’s not a right or wrong answer? There necessarily. You could say that, hey, I want to, you know, I want to buy a house that is ours, you know, and that’s something that I would counsel if that’s something that you want to you know, that’s something that seems to be a pretty smart move. But also, if you’re gonna stay in that house, are you paying rent? Are you how, how are things going to be paid? For? What kind of access are y’all gonna have to each other’s monies? Because it’s becoming more and more commonplace? That, you know, people keep, you know, we’re going to keep our money separate, right. But here’s something to understand. In Texas, folks. That doesn’t mean jack diddly shit. It doesn’t have any impact at all, because that’s all still community property. All of it is still community. What’s yours is yours. And what’s yours is mine. Yeah, that’s what community Yeah, basic. Exactly. Okay. So, so just because you’ve kept it separate, and they’ve got 100,000 over here, and you’ve got $15.23. Yeah, guess what? The $100,015.23 is, what is community? Right? Yeah. So you are? That’s right, you’re just as entitled to those monies as the other party. Right. So, you know, that’s something that people need to understand.
Cindy Hyde 34:14
They do. And I think oftentimes, you know, in situations like this, that, you know, the unsafe parent has been, you know, so emotionally abused over the years, and they’re often told that they can’t survive without the abusive partner. And so then, you know, when it comes time to divorce one, they can’t afford an attorney because all the money’s been held, you know, out of their reach, right. And then two, you know, they they don’t think that they can financially survive without them, and they don’t think they’ll get anything in the divorce because that’s what they’re threatened. They’re told, you know, you won’t get anything if you leave me. And so because of that a lot of women will stay when they should actually be consulting an attorney, you know, as quickly as possible.
Mark Scroggins 34:59
Yeah. salutely And that goes for that goes for both men. And
Cindy Hyde 35:03
absolutely, yeah. Because it can it can actually be in the reverse. I know a lot of times we, you know, we talk about it’s it’s him, you know, and safe parent is her but it can be in the reverse. Yeah,
Mark Scroggins 35:16
yeah, I mean, and I see that kind of stuff happen all the time it is more and more common that I’m seeing, you know, a stay at home husband, you know, in these scenarios, and wife is the, the big earner. And you know, and so these can be totally, you know, flipped on their head. So, the last one on this wheel is coercion and threats.
Cindy Hyde 35:40
Yeah, you know, so, you know, forcing her to borrow money from her family, you know, because maybe he spent it all doing something else gambling or whatever he’s into, but oftentimes to what one of the things they’ll do is they’ll start trying to coerce the children into living with them, especially if they’re old enough to have some input. So that they don’t have to pay child support. So they’ll do things like that trying to or, or they’ll scream, you know, parental alienation and try to bleed her financially dry so that then she’ll ultimately give up custody of the children because she can no longer afford them or the attorney fees. So when you start, when you
Mark Scroggins 36:21
start talking about coercing the children, to live with them, what does that look like?
Cindy Hyde 36:25
Well, and sometimes what they’ll do is they’ll be like Disney dad, whenever the children are around. So they’ll, they’ll play the, you know, it’s always going to be like this at dad’s house, right? And so, so the children think, well, I’m going to Disneyland, you know, this is great, I don’t want to live with you this, you know, I have rules over here. And I can’t, you know, I can’t have anything because we can’t afford anything, right. And so so it looks very appealing on that side. And so it doesn’t really take much, you know, just takes the unsafe parent making it look really beautiful on their side. Yeah.
Mark Scroggins 37:00
So what do you think of scenarios where, let’s say, one parent buys an iPad, for him, but doesn’t let you know, this is where I see this. And I, I see this as being ridiculous. You know, one parent buys an iPad for but no, that iPad has to stay over here, you can’t take it over there, you can’t use it all the time. Yeah, so that would kind of be the scenario that you’re talking about. We’ve all got all this great stuff, and all these great clothes and everything, but you can’t wear something and take it over to you know, mom or dad’s house, you got to keep it over here doesn’t get to me.
Cindy Hyde 37:37
And then on that iPad, they get to do anything they want. Right? So they get to watch whatever they want, you know, listen to whatever they want chat with whoever they want. But over here, there’s rules that, you know, they can’t, you know, they have to go to bed at nine or 10 o’clock. And they you know, they can’t be on certain sites, and they can’t, you know, watch certain types of shows. And so it makes this parent look, even though this parents trying to, you know, you know, hold the child accountable and to a standard and not let them get into unsafe things. The child over here thinks this is gonna be great, I’m gonna go live with that I’ll be able to stay up until two or three o’clock in the morning plan, whatever I want. And, you know, why wouldn’t I want to live over there?
Mark Scroggins 38:19
Right? Well, so we’ve gone through these, these cogs on the wheel. So whatever, what other words of advice would you have to people that, you know, they need to be watching out for? To make sure that they don’t fall into one of these categories? Yeah, but he scenarios,
Cindy Hyde 38:39
you know, like I said earlier, I think knowing what the household finances are, and making sure that you have easy access to those things that you have the passwords, you know, just like you know, anything you have, that it should, it should be shared also, but to you know, I feel like you know, doing your homework before you marry someone, you know, making sure that that person, you know, will honor your boundaries that you know, they’re not going to take advantage of you in that way. I think that’s really important. And then to also monitor your own finances. You know, in the marriage situation, making sure that you know, you have a safety net, should you need it to be able to seek legal advice.
Mark Scroggins 39:26
Well, that is all fantastic advice. And thank you for joining us again and we will look forward to the next scenario. And maybe next time we will, I think we have gone through the wheel. So we will get through into a few other things. So thanks again for joining us. Thank you. Thank you all for being here and joining us for another episode of the Reclamation Transformation and remember, change starts with you so leave your mark.
